Wednesday, July 28, 2010

Addressing A Complaint of Bait & Switch

This is a photo of the actual sample of material we were shown by the salesman.

He kept saying it was a quarter inch thick. (0.25”)
Note the measurement shown on the digital calipers.
0.131”, a little more than half of a quarter inch.

Granted, we knew it was not a quarter inch, but subsequent conversations to other Re-Bath professionals also stated the wall panel material was ¼ of an inch thick.
Why was the thickness so often referred to as a quarter of an inch thick? Don’t they know/see the difference? Maybe they didn’t think anyone would check? Or know? We can’t answer that.

Since the salesman showed us “the actual material” the mistaken use of a description of a larger size does not make it a Bait & Switch issue.

But wait! Now look at this photo of the actual material that was installed, we kept a remnant to prove what we noticed, that it is not only less than a ¼ inch, but it is less than the sample thickness of 0.131 too.
It is also a softer material. Not just softer due to being thinner in our opinion, but it seems to be a different density too.

To be fair, we did not measure it at the formed edge; that area is even thinner due to the stretching around the bend.
Notice the thickness? Only 0.093 inches thin. That is a difference of 0.038” from what we were shown and sold to what was installed. That is less than 71%. Well under three-fourths the thickness of what we were sold, now that meets the definition of Bait & Switch don’t you think? Let alone the difference in the density of the material.

Here’s something that is a quarter inch! But it is just the sample of accent colors…
Now maybe this is what the sales people are thinking of when they use that line about the wall panels being ¼ inch thick. It is not true, and wouldn’t you want a more knowledgeable sales person than one who can’t understand these differences? Yep, more supposition on our part, thinking out loud as it were, we don’t know why.
But we do know that what we were told/sold did not match what was installed.

Here’s the official Re-Bath sales samples and our remnant.
A lot of complaints online list Bait & Switch as one of the problems other Re-Bath customers and people just checking out Re-Bath have reported. Could this be a part of what they are referring to?

Be sure to do your research before hiring any contractor!

Wednesday, July 21, 2010

Take A Bow? No, Take The Bow Out

Here's one more "live action" shot of how poorly yet another wall was installed.
See how bowed in at the light switch it was?
See the flex?
See how it is not properly adhered to the wall?
Notice the depth difference between the two switches?
video
Randy from Re-Bath of Ca originally told us he would replace this incorrectly installed wall when he came out on 10-12-07 and inspected the work done. (See our post in this blog from Friday, July 25, 2008)
Not all of them, not two of them (see video of mixer valve wall…), just this one.
But instead he sued us, even after agreeing it was not acceptable workmanship to our faces.

He didn’t even serve us the court summons legally. He just mailed it via regular mail and we received it shortly before the court date. (It should be served via Certified Mail. Or by a party not involved in the action.)
Then, in court and under oath, he originally claimed the Sheriff had served us, but we had already checked with and had verification from the Sheriff department that he never hired the Sheriff department to serve us. Of course he had no proof from the Sheriff, (as we do from our countersuit) to back up that false claim.

Then he claimed his father, Lloyd Summy served us in our front yard. Lloyd Summy was the name on the contractor’s license Randy Summy used, and apparently was the previous Re-Bath franchise owner (if not the actual or co-owner) so he was not qualified to serve us. (See our post in this blog from Thursday, July 31, 2008 )

So which story was the truth Mr. Re-Bath? The correct answer is neither.

Oh yeah, did we mention we never saw, let alone spoke to Lloyd Summy, not for lack of trying. (Actually, yes we did mention that…) And, he was NEVER at or on our property, (at least when we were there, but that is another story) so that would constitute a lie would it not? (In court under oath, is that perjury?)

This shows the level this Re-Bath “owner” was willing to go to instead of just doing the ethical thing he said he would do. (He gave us his “word”.) That would have been to repair the mess his company made.

Is that the kind of service you would want from a contractor? Do your homework, do your own research, before hiring Re-Bath or any contractor.

Tuesday, July 20, 2010

A Movie and A Picture… A Disaster Double Feature… With a Trailer…

More from the file of what we brought as evidence to the court when we were unjustly sued for not paying due to Re-Bath of Ca not finishing the job.

Here's another live action shot, this time of another improperly attached wall, (like the one where the light switch is located).
Also note, the plumbing was not even anchored to anything inside the wall. When we pulled on the mixer valve, it came out of the escutcheon without turning on.
We don't think it was to code at all... And subsequently our thoughts on that were proven to be true.
And little did we know at the time this was shot, it was already leaking and in the not too distant future our downstairs ceiling would cave from the plumbing leak of this Re-Bath mixer valve installation.



video


One reason for this unacceptable flexing of the wall is this:

Foam was used to “shore up”, or construct the wall at the area Re-Bath removed the tiles and wall board from to install the shower mixer valve.
Just soft foam! Seems to us like a cheap way to go. We were later told that GreenBoard was the correct material to use.
Would you want this in your bathroom?
They also neglected to properly anchor the pipe in the wall to the framing.


It leaked enough for the water to soak into the wooden floor from the other side (inside) of the wall and rot it:

And caused our kitchen ceiling below to come down from being waterlogged…

Monday, July 19, 2010

We Have Movies! If a picture is worth a 1000 words, what’s a movie worth?

This is the shower seat Re-Bath "switched" on us described in an earlier post.
We were sold an altogether different looking and much sturdier seat. We complained before the installation of it when we were shown this item. (At the time we were not aware of the switching products/materials tactic that other people have also pointed out in their Re-Bath complaints).
We were told this one is the only one we could get, especially if we wanted our new bathroom done... (Well, not on time, but you probably get the picture (movie?) if you have been following our story). Yeah, like that was the only hang up to getting it finished...

video

As you can see it is very flimsy, it broke only a short time after we started using it, and no, we are not big/fat people. When it was removed we found out they did not even properly mount it to the studs. Just press in anchors into the old tile. But they had siliconed it to the wall, like that would hold it!?
The reality of why it failed is the product was cheap and poorly designed. Plus it is not what we were sold or charged for! Is this a good representation of Bait & Switch?

We really could have used that safety grab rail they never installed when it let loose too...

Friday, July 16, 2010

Floor Damage Pictures

Here are a couple more shots of the bathroom floor just after they “installed” their wares. The flooring was only a few years old and in fine shape when Re-Bath came to do their work. Here is the other corner they tore up at the base of the shower pan. Not just a cosmetic issue, water getting through did some rotting of the wooden floor below (at both corners).
And before you say, that doesn't look all that bad, remember any damage requires the replacement of the entire floor, including removing the toilet. But the audacity to claim it was this way before the work was done? Before he ever saw it?

Also take a look at the scuffs and damage that they caused elsewhere. The owner who had never been to our home prior to after the attempted installation had been “finished, but with more work needed”, said the floor was already that way and said we were liars for pointing out the damage as being caused by them. Never mind he had no way of knowing what our floor was like before, and that it was not torn and scuffed up, as he saw it, before his workers came to work at our home. Now tell us, who appears to be the liar?

Thursday, July 15, 2010

Alignment was a problem too.

How about this for plumb alignment?
In just the width of the small window the levelness is of by over a full 1/4 inch in the span of about 2 feet.
Now the house already had a window, and it was/is level, so the part that is installed crooked is Re-Bath’s work.
Right side; note the measurement from the center of the grid line to the bottom of the window framing is less than 2 inches:

Left Side; note the measurement from the center of the grid line to the bottom of the window framing is just a tick short of 2 and ¼ inches:

Acceptable alignment "quality" to you for a nearly $6000.00 investment? Didn’t think so…

But off on just one horizontal plane? It also is not plumb (true flat) on the top plane. Note the triangle is square to the metal window frame. We understand draft for drainage but that is excessive, (although since the window assembly has weep holes was it really even necessary?).
Notice there is still the packing tape on the corner trim pieces so it is still very new/fresh, yet look at the caulking...
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A side note, this "window" wall panel detached itself from the wall not long after it was installed and bowed outwardly quite a bit below the window. It was not adhered correctly over the existing tile they attached it to apparently...

Point being Re-Bath did not install their own product in a commonly accepted aesthetically pleasing way, or in a properly functioning way. Why?

And as if this wasn’t enough, it wasn’t even centered (left to right) on the wall/window! But we, the customers, were the ones blamed for this by the Re-Bath franchise owner. We still do not understand that mentality or attitude.

Wednesday, July 14, 2010

Alignment issues…

Check out this horizontal alignment. We were assured the grid lines molded into the wall panels would line up in corners by the salesman, just like our old tile, but the installers said they couldn't do it and the Re-Bath franchise owner said it was normal for them to not line up and furthermore claimed we agreed to this mis-match. (!?)
Absolutely not true, we did not agree to this bad alignment, and could not have, as we did not speak to him until after there were problems. Why would anyone want a lower quality in aesthetics "upgrade"?
Now for a fair photo comparison, below is what we were shown at the showroom as to what the corner alignment of the horizontal grid lines would look like.
To be clear, the sales literature brought by the salesman before we purchased showed photos of the same quality and clean alignment as we saw in the showroom.
We took these photos at our local Re-Bath showroom after the installation to show what Re-Bath shows the public and how it differed from what they installed and vehemently tried to make us accept:

Note how nice they were able to line those corner grid lines up? Not really indicative of what they installed in our home now is it?



Tuesday, July 13, 2010

The caulk is not the worst of the problems…

Again, more photos we took and submitted in court, under oath, to defend ourselves from being sued by Re-Bath for not approving of their “workmanship” that they refused to even finish before suing.
Remember their sales pitch, “You don’t pay in full until you are fully satisfied.” Well, the Re-Bath we dealt with apparently only used that as a sales pitch, it's words rang hollow when we asked them to honor that guarantee.


Check out the bow in this wall. Look at the gap behind the light switch. Is this acceptable? In what world? We don't think it was accetable, or even up to code, yet Re-Bath apparently did...

Not only is that bow significant, take note of the amount of recess the light switch is set back in with (the right hand side of the two switches) while the fan switch is flush.


Both a vertical and horizontal bow. We were told how rigid this product was, and that it was 1/4 inch thick. But what they installed was even thinner than the samples (under 1/4 inch thick too) they left. (We can provide photos of the material and samples they left too.)


For a comparison, here is what that wall looked like before we had Re-Bath do this "upgrade".
And also note the absence of the gouge in the door jamb. This photo was shot just before the “work” began.



Caulk debris in the clear silicone... Nice... Just shows the “attention to detail”.





Monday, July 12, 2010

Pictures, More Pictures...

Here are more photos showing the level of "quality" we received from Re-Bath's first attempt to do a shower installation.

This is a baseboard they cut to make the plastic wall panel fit, and the caulking they did...
Notice the nice horizontal chunk they took out of the wood? We did. This is what they considered as "finished". Would anyone reading this honestly consider this good work?



Here is an example of the caulk work they did at the tub/floor line. One of the corners where they hacked the floor up an the shower base was already shown earlier.

Also note that this was taken before we were able (allowed?) to use the shower, so the hair is not ours. Yes, a bit disgusting.



More of the trim, it was like this throughout the entire caulk job.

Here's another nice shot, note the use of silicone caulk that cannot be painted over on the ceiling.

And where they damaged the paint by their "workmanship". More unbelievable caulk work too. Yes, we were expected to pay a premium to Re-Bath for this level of work.



More chips and errant caulk...


Note that we were assured the walls and ceiling would not be damaged by the installation prior to contracting wit Re-Bath by the (unlicensed) salesman. And once it was damaged, we were told it was our responsibilty to fix it at our own expense.
Would you pay nearly $6000.00 for this level of "craftsmanship"? It certainly is not what we were sold...

Thursday, July 8, 2010

It is nice to have learned how to post pictures, perfect timing.

Here is some more of the sloppy caulking we were assured was an acceptable standard by Re-Bath of CA. The worst part is it is a silicone based caulk that rendered that door jamb unpaintable even after removing the caulk. Note both colors are pooly done, but wait, why is there white on the jamb in the first place?

Nice gouge, more evidence of the "care" that went into the installation, and yes, were were accused by Randy of claiming they did it "that it was there before". Trust us, they did make the gouge...
Here's another classic shot. They tore up the floor (note the same style of caulking at the base too, about as close to continuity we got) and then Randy claimed it was that way when they got there.

Well, it was that way when he got there, because his crack team did the damage, but this was the first time Randy had been to our home, how on earth could he know? But he argued in court under oath it was that way before the installers started...
Notice that they didn't even install a Re-Bath pan after all the bragging and selling us on how high the Re-Bath quality was? We're not sure if this is Bait & Switch, but the Re-Bath pan we ended up with is not as much of a flexi-flyer as this one was. Who are we kidding, not sure if it was Bait & Switch? Look at the label.

It is truly mind boggling how many complaints there are on the internet regarding Re-Bath.

Even more staggering is how many of those complaints share the same basic complaints of overcharging, rude and abrasive franchise operators, materials installed that don’t match the samples and descriptions of what was sold, the term Bait & Switch is commonly used, lack of response once the first chunk of money was handed over… You see the point.
As well as many complaints of the same handful of people at the corporate office not helping customers who have had these problems.

Our case is interesting in the way the original (not properly licensed) Re-Bath contractor we unfortunately hired has continued to harass us even when we let the blog go dormant. Amazingly he is still threatening us two years and nine months after the job was supposed to have been finished.

We have to ask, what could possibly make this guy so vindictive to his customers (victims?)?. How many others is he doing this to?

We invite everyone who has had a bad Re-Bath experience, especially one with the Re-Bath of Ca located in Signal Hill/Long Beach Ca to comment in our blog. We are very curious to find out if he has chosen us specifically, or if we are just one of many that are being treated this way by him.

In the mean time we found even more complaints so we again are wondering why he has taken this old (we thought it was over and done with) problem to this degree?
After all, he sued us before finishing the job or fulfilling the contract (and lost) but we did not win anything and he kept the payment we made for his unfinished crappy work.
Everyone was a loser, but we lost worse.

So here are some more links to Re-Bath Complaints for all over the country, and they were like the others, on the first page:

http://www.houserepairtalk.com/f45/re-warning-about-re-bath-3248/index2.html

http://www.tabberone.com/ReBathSucks2/ReBathSucks.shtml

http://www.complaintsboard.com/bycompany/rebath-a50450.html

This could have all gone dormant and possibly faded away, but from the harassment we are receiving it looks like there is a need for keeping it going… By law we are entitled to share our opinions and experiences…

Wednesday, July 7, 2010

Since they say a picture is worth a thousand words…

We thought it was time to start sharing this irrefutable evidence of the “workmanship” Re-Bath did when they first tried to install our shower. Mind you, these are the exact same photos we showed in court and (deemed in the public domain as such), presented and accepted under oath as proof of the shoddy work done to our home by the Re-Bath franchise Mr. Summy “owns”. Please recall that he sued us (before finishing the job and without benefit of proper contractor licensing) and therefore saw these pictures then. Nothing was said at that time (under oath too) by him that these were not factual representations of the “quality” of work done by his franchise.

Are you following all that? These photos were shot the day following the installation (10-7-07). Please note that the "One Day, Stress Free, No Mess" installation started on 10-5-07 and was never truly finished by Re-Bath of CA. Anyone can do the math and see it was not done in one, let alone two days.

Let’s start with an example of the exquisite alignment skills of the installers. Notice the packing tape still hold this trim piece “straight”? Yes, the caulk is fully dry and that was deemed acceptable by them. Also note the slopped caulk at the top of the window frame. Except for the house's glass and metal frame window, this is 100% Re-Bath work.

How about we show some of their incredible caulk work? Unbelievable as it may seem, this is exactly the work that was done around the window (dried) and they claimed this was fully acceptable caulking. Can you believe it?





We have many more photos as we had to take a lot of them since we were sued by the owner of the Re-Bath because we had the audacity to ask that he make good on his word of finishing this job before paying the balance.
Remember their slogan about the customer doesn't pay until the job is done to their satisfaction. Hmm, just realized they might mean Re-Bath when they say "their". Not the customer. Plausible?
We needed to prove he had not even tried to finish before suing us. We would not have needed to document this had he not caused this situation…
And since we had to eat the cost of printing them for the court, it seems only fair we share them with the rest of the world.

And before you blast us for not just re-doing the crappy caulking, think about this, if you were being charged almost $6000.00 to do this job, wouldn’t you expect a lot better quality?

Tuesday, July 6, 2010

We just found these similar complaints by doing a Google search for “rebath”.

It was the second link from the top of the page that wasn’t a paid advertisement (by Re-Bath).
So it clearly is not just us that have had problems or see a pattern of the way this company works:

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/homeowners/re-bath.html

Is it irony that doing a search for one company by their name brings forth a link to so many problems and complaints? No, it is not irony…

Now, if you do a Google search for “re bath complaints”, look at what comes up as the first link on page one:

http://rebath.pissedconsumer.com/

Of particular interest to us was this comment:

http://rebath.pissedconsumer.com/pacific-coast-rebath-bad-product-bad-warranty-20100428180076.html


While we do not know if it is the same franchise that we originally contracted with, the coincidences / similarities of the situations are astounding.

Whether it is or isn’t the same outfit, let’s pose this question, which is worse?
The same problems repeated by one franchise, or multiple franchises creating the same problems? See a pattern?

In fact, there are very many such websites, web pages and blogs dedicated to this one company and its franchises illuminating the problems many many consumers have had with them.

Maybe a full list, a catalog if you, will should be compiled to help protect consumers? Maybe someone will do that.

To the authors of those posts in the provided links: We sincerely hope it is OK that we posted those links in our blog. We will gladly remove them if asked by those who are responsible for originally posting them, but since it is offering protection in providing similar information to potential consumers, we thought it was the right thing to do. We only want what is best for the consumers. Just respond via the comments option. Thanks.